Christian BoyLove Forum #48724

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Re: Diverging from the original point....

Posted by Blackstone on 2007-01-23 11:46:40, Tuesday
In reply to Re: Diverging from the original point.... posted by CliveStaplesLewis on 2007-01-23 09:26:12, Tuesday

If we go back to creation, we still find clear evidence that we are not spiritual beings and were never meant to be. Humanity was created by God during the creation of the physical world. This is very clear in the account of creation:


Genesis 2:7 the LORD God formed the man from the dust of the ground and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life, and the man became a living being.


Is there any way you can twist that verse until it means that we are spiritual beings? I can't see any way of doing that. It is very clear that God created man during the creation of the world and he made him out of dust and breathed life into him. This is all clear evidence that we are not spiritual beings, but physical ones created on the same level as everything else in the world.

This doesn't however, prove why we were created. Could it be we were created for a spiritual life and not a physical one? Let's read further along to find out:

Genesis 2:15 The LORD God took the man and put him in the Garden of Eden to work it and take care of it.


Now we know why God originally created man. Man was a physical being created by God to take care of the rest of creation.

There is no room in the biblical account of creation for theories about spiritual beings meant for spiritual lives somewhere other than Earth. You would have to dismiss the creation story in order to believe that. The bible clearly shows that man was created a physical being and given life by God so he could care for the rest of creation. Not that man is a spiritual being created for life separate from creation.

As for your statements about Luke and John, I would like to see some evidence. Luke was very much a realist. He was a doctor by profession and his gospel is the result of meticulous primary and secondary research. His gospel is known for its scientific flavour. So, I find it hard to believe that he was more concerned with the esoteric aspect. I'm going to have to see evidence of that in order to believe it. As for John, I could see how that might be, but I'd still like to see the evidence because with out it it remains an empty assertion.

The idea that we are our body pervades the entire bible and was believed by every writer of scripture. It fits the account of creation perfectly without the need to do any mental acrobatics in order to dismiss the fact that humans were part of creation, created from dust for the purpose of taking care of the Earth. It also helps us better understand important biblical themes such as the resurrection of the dead, or the fact our body is a temple and should be taken care of.

More importantly, however. The main point I wanted to make is that the idea among Christians that the Zoroastrians and Hindus might be right about personhood is a relatively new one. If you trace the historical origins of this belief you will find that it was not shared by any of the early Christians and is a newer development in the Christian religion. This is not my opinion, it is historical fact.

Now, this does not necessarily mean that it isn't the case. It could very well be that our understanding of the soul and what constitutes a person has evolved and is more correct now than it was when Christianity was in its infancy and the bible was still being written. But, I don't believe this is the case.

If we look at extra-biblical evidence that was not available to the Christians of the 1st century, we find some surprises that seem to back their view over the one many Christians have adopted from the new age movement. Modern science has proven that changes to the brain can cause changes in personality. Brain damage, both accidental and as a result of a lobotomy can cause severe changes in personality. A person can go from being an outgoing extrovert to a shy introvert in seconds as a result of changes in the brain. Not only that, but brain imaging technology clearly shows how mood is the result of chemical changes in the brain. This seems to point to the fact that our personality lies in the brain, not in our soul. If the brain holds our personality, then what is the soul? In all likelyhood, the early Christians, and the Jews were right. The soul is just the spark of life, your mind and body are what define who you really are. Without your mind or body, your soul would be just like electricity that doesn't have an appliance to charge.

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